I think it's only fair to warn everybody who's posting links to Youtube videos and recordings that there are low-lifes that are selling those recordings on eBay. It sort of makes the tapers/videographers unpaid accessories to piracy. It's a shame, since some of the Stones' best fans share their excitement by freely giving others copies of their pictures and recordings in forums like this one.

This is why I'm afraid to share any of my recordings or videos with anybody any more. Once they get into circulation, it's only a matter of time before some scumbag downloads it and starts selling cruddy CD-Rs/DVD-Rs on eBay.

Here's an example of just one seller who appears to sell only CD-R and DVD-R copies of concerts and other boots. Most have amateurish or even juvenile artwork displayed. Some may even be pirated copies of official releases -- I don't know how 'official' the release was on one listing I saw, but it had what appeared to be a Russian copyright notice on the artwork for the jewel case. This seller's been at it for a while, though:

[www.ebay.com]

I haven't seen any text descriptions, other than a poorly-worded graphic included with some of the titles, which says:

"You are bidding on a CDR that is an
excellent sounding, audienced sourced
recording. Included in purchase will
the pictured disc without jewel case.
Cover and tray artwork will emailed to
winning bidder."

Here are some short auctions for Stones boots just from the Zip Code tour (he has many other Stones titles and many other artists). Once a round of auctions closes, he starts the next round.

San Diego

Minneapolis

Atlanta

Orlando

Nashville

Pittsburgh

He's not the only seller doing this on eBay. You don't have to look far to find many, many others doing basically the same thing. On any listing, if you look closely, you can find a little "Report this item" link under the seller's info box (if it will do any good).

Ebay has become the sewer of capitalism, offering a safe-haven for the fencing of stolen and shoplifted merchandise, pirated music and movies and new forms of wire fraud that are so new, we still have to invent names for them. It amazes me how quickly ticket scalping went mainstream. I guess all forms of piracy and shoplifting won't be far behind.

I'm curious who is actually buying this crap. I would think that most of the people in the market for Stones bootlegs would know enough not to have any interest in these. Maybe they catch some fans who don't belong to any of the communities and don't know how freely we share these shows.

i'd say the people interested in these are people how want the shows on CD quickly, and don't want or are not capable of downloading them.

I also agree...who would buy this crap.
They should be putting a disclaimer saying "no Mick Taylor"....

In general, there seems to be a lot more bootleg CDs on eBay again.

There is no point these days to pay for bootlegs, but 20 years ago I would blush like a little girl if I saw such CDs in my record store.

We need to keep the Rolling Stones on our side. If we want to keep posting links to fan recordings or periscopes of these concerts, we need to report these sellers to eBay. If you see something, say something.

We should protect the members of iorr, since if the Stones get pissed enough about the pirates of eBay, they'll bring the whip down on us -- both here on the forum (for sharing links) and at concerts (where searches will get tighter and more intrusive).

You'll also be doing a tremendous favor for the Stones fans who don't know that this stuff is freely available for download. Many of the sellers (including the one mentioned above) are selling CD-Rs that will fail after a few months or years, not the store-bought quality pressed 'silvers' that can last for (at least) decades.

I don't care as much about eBay as I do about people who go to concerts and take pictures, shoot videos, make recordings, bitcast periscopes and/or share links to pictures, videos, 'scopes or recordings. If you have done any of that or have enjoyed viewing and/or listening to any of that, you've got something to lose.

Everybody here who has an eBay account really needs to report these items to eBay. When I've spoken to them in the past, they've said that sometimes it takes two or three people making the same complaint before they'll act.

If you click on the Report link, you are presented with a series of drop-down lists. Just select 'Copyright and trademark' category, 'Bootleg records' as the reason for the report and 'Unauthorized media' for the detailed reason. Your report actually only takes 4 or 5 mouse clicks, before you get a thank-you message.

Yes by all means, let's stop these criminals from taking money out of the Stones pockets. Oh the humanity!

I really can't understand that there are people who would buy these shit, starting bit is 20$ I wouldn't even pay 1$ ...if it's from R~u~s~s~i~a I wonder if you receive anything after you paid...........

__________________________

I don't have to worry about them taking money out of the Stones' pockets, since I'm sure the Stones pay somebody or some company to do that for them.

I love listening to these shared recordings and periscope feeds. If the Stones crack down on piracy on eBay, they could make life difficult for the tapers and traders and forum communities that share them.

Quote
donvis
Yes by all means, let's stop these criminals from taking money out of the Stones pockets. Oh the humanity!

Live and let live. Although I was once pretty serious in my dislike for all thefts of creative property, it has become such a ubiquitous thing these days it's hard to care much.

My friend has a very popular music store which sells tons of bootleg material and rare recordings and he still gets calls from sellers with trac phones and mobile fax machines pumping their product from the shadows of the business world.

The RIAA still gets pretty serious about the piracy issue with hotlines and web pages to report offenders. Here is a link to their policy on the issue:

[www.riaa.com]

interesting that Minneapolis is on the list. I've been waiting for that one to show up on DIME but it seems to be the only show of the tour that hasn't.

I'm of to the shop buying myself a stock of 100 CD-R's. Probably will cost me 25 Euro. Some recycled color cartridges and a stack of heavy paper (another 25 to 30 euro)
Going to burn fifty 2-cd shows, print some artwork and put them on e-bay.
If I'm getting $20 for each one, I'm going to make a profit of around $850.00.

Seriously, if all people that responded in this thread would report those E-bay offers (as I did) and we would form a small group that's looking out
for such sellers so we can inform each other so there are a couple of reports, maybe, just maybe, we could get some of those guys off the market.
.

Chris from Belgium

Utter hypocrisy. I would bet a hefty sum of money that 99% of contributors to this forum have purchased bootleg albums / CDs in the past with care or thought as to where the material was obtained or where the money went. And yet people are now bleating about people exploiting youtube videos to make money. So bloody what?

You can not compare the past and now!

In the past you could only get recordings by buying, trading, treeing and the like.
Now some people are coming to IORR, or Dime, or TTD, or....., and when they see a new show (for free!!!) they try to make money with it.

.

Chris from Belgium





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-06-23 21:14 by coowouters.

You guys are missing the point. The RIAA and the Rolling Stones can take care of themselves. I'm suggesting that the members iorr.org start to take care of themselves as a community (Chris is right).

We share recordings, so we bear the responsibility of watching out for abuses. Have you checked the listings I mentioned? Some are bid up to almost $80 now (maybe by an undercover FBI agent, if there is a God). The fact that CD-Rs are going for that much money has got to draw the attention of somebody -- whether it's the Stones, the RIAA or the FBI isn't as important as how much we stand to lose if they put a stop to taping.

I don't want anybody cracking down on concert recording the way they're cracking down on recording movies in theaters. I don't want bv catching grief from the Stones organization about posts/links to recordings on his board.

I wish I felt comfortable with sharing my own recordings and videos, but I don't.

I don't care if someone puts up an original bootleg from VGP, RS or whatever bootleg label, what pisses me of is these guys making money with freely distributed shows.
If I was a taper and shared my recordings for free, I would NOT be happy if someone else tried to make money with something I had to take a risk for and have been working on to make it sound good before sharing it here or on a torrent site for free.

.

Chris from Belgium

Very frustrating to see. If can understand if people are willing to pay big bucks for professional factory pressed bootleg sets containing original recordings, like this one I found (bit too expensive for me):
Far East 98 12-cd

These awful cd-r sets however has zero collecting value, and I would feel bad about even having them on my shelf. Not much to do about I'm afraid



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2015-06-23 21:41 by EasterMan.

Bruce ends this by selling his own shows, that effectively stopped the tapers. Mind you, the output from his band was consistently good, even if some of his recording techniques early on 2014 weren't

Mick Jagger is known to try to make money out of everything these days, so I do not understand why he doesn't approve of selling recordings of all shows.

Imagine that (like with these folders you get at the entrance to get pictures of the show), they would do the same and a week later, after paying a decent sum, you get the show in a digipack. Nothing fancy, just the essential.

But then again, only the real fans would order them and they would soon find their way to certain torrent sites that don't care about official or not.

.

Chris from Belgium

You are spot on about eBay sellers. In the past there was a bigger market for boots. I got into hardcore collecting around 97 when Sister Morphine was putting out rereleases of old boots remixed. At one time I reviewed them etc. Fun stuff but I could never understand why people would pay $50 for silver discs. Trading always made more sense to me.

Every recording I have ever done has been ripped off and sold by someone online. That's the risk. You tape a show, put it out for free, and then someone tries to make some money off it. I have never made a dime off any recording. I am just glad that fellow fans can enjoy whatever I put out.

I wish I could meet the engineer for Handsome Girls. The guy working the sound on those shows influenced me to get into production. I wouldn't own a production company if it weren't for that recording propelling me into bootlegging shows and opening a recording studio.

What's wrong with it?
I do buy boots silver pressed between €35 & €55 with nice lay out's.
I don't want to collect cd-r's, buying or trading or downloading.
I do not buy on e bay.
If people calls it "crab", how to call a cd-r?

Quote
tioms
What's wrong with it?
I do buy boots silver pressed between €35 & €55 with nice lay out's.
I don't want to collect cd-r's, buying or trading or downloading.
I do not buy on e bay.
If people calls it "crab", how to call a cd-r?

I don't get your point...
We're talking about people who download recordings here or on a torrent site, burn them on CD-r, make some crappy artwork and try to sell it on e-bay for $20 or more (and they often get more!)

Silver pressed Bootlegs are something completely different; those are professionally made, good quality CD's, nice artwork, often with a booklet and/or nicely packed in a box or in another way. (and yes, I know; those bootleg labels also often "steal" someone else's upload)

I used to collect silvers, but sold most of them. I do download most shows now to my HD, put them on one of my external HD's and listen to them on my PC. Once in a while I burn one for use in my car, but that's it. (same for DVD's; they are downloaded to a HD, I watch them on my PC and if there's one I want to look at on a larger screen, I burn it to a DVD-RW)

.

Chris from Belgium

You,people who are giving the shows for free,,,

I do appreciate your doings, but you give the totally freedom to make this for free.

People who are going out for money, you give or gave them the stuff to do it for free!!!!

So, do not blame those people.

There are many people who can't work with downloading.

And then they buy on e-bay and silver pressed!!!

So, do stop to give your stuff for free!!! And do not blame others.

Who is who after all???

Quote
tioms

There are many people who can't work with downloading.

Who? Retards? I can understand torrents can be a bit tricky at times but direct downloads?

Quote
dcba

Quote
tioms

There are many people who can't work with downloading.

Who? Retards? I can understand torrents can be a bit tricky at times but direct downloads?

some people do work at their work, and not downloading i.e. they earn their bread with sweat on their face as Bible said and/or contribute to society as iorrian mickyjaggeroo once said... i think that deserves some respect

Quote
NathanLaze

Quote
dcba

Quote
tioms

There are many people who can't work with downloading.

Who? Retards? I can understand torrents can be a bit tricky at times but direct downloads?

some people do work at their work, and not downloading i.e. they earn their bread with sweat on their face as Bible said and/or contribute to society as iorrian mickyjaggeroo once said... i think that deserves some respect

OK, I'm retired, but nobody works 24/7!
As for downloading; we usually give you a choice; Filefactory, Wetransfer and Mega.
And you wouldn't believe me if I told you how many e-mails I get asking to re-upload something to WT!!!

And I do respect those who contribute to society!
.

Chris from Belgium

$170.00 for what ? are you kidding me ? a fan recorded CD OF THE SHOW FOR A $170.00 just makes me puke !

I saw one for Orlando go for $220 (plus s/h).

I hate seeing people get ripped off like that. I used to get excited about finding new recordings of concerts and sharing them (or sharing my own recordings), but now I feel like I'm partly to blame -- like I've had a part in creating a monster (those eBay sellers who are ripping people off with homemade CD-Rs).

Like I said in a previous post, I can't feel good about sharing my recordings any more. That really sucks, because I was always proud of my recordings. I understand how it got to Mike Millard after a while.

The more you post for free: downloading, torrent or what's so ever the more comes on e-bay in cdr's or dvdr's
I do not buy those things, I only buy silver pressed cd's and dvd's, in Japan nice lay out's,booklets,and included the dvd. Price between 80 & 85 euro (for a 2cd and dvd) all included, postage, customs and import. But I can live with it.
For me no downloadings or cdr's or dvdr's, only silver pressed.

I always first ask to an Ebay seller if it's a fabric made silver disc or a cd-r/dvd-r. If I don't get an answer back or I just don't trust it, I don't buy the item. But even then, sometimes you get a cd-r anyway. So long live Paypall! I always got my money back and succeed to get one seller off Ebay.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2015-07-20 21:38 by GJV.