Does anyone know?

Excellent question, and I really look forward to reading the responses to it. I can't contribute anything myself I'm afraid, being one of those tone deaf imbeciles that picked up a guitar when I was 18 - and today 32 years later I probably still know just the same half dozen chords that I learned then !! But my "interest" remains undiminshed. Yeah, so who else did they audition, and who came close, and did it cause rows within the band ? I heard, and I think it has probably been confirmed as being true, that the rest of the boys basically let Charlie have the final say about Daryl ? Is this so ?

Bill Wyman's gone?

Doug Wimbish was considered but he chose Living Colour, and yes Charlie had the final saying

The Stones auditioned many bassists. I don't want to name names that I don't know anything about but I know two guys personally who really are not on the who'w ho of Bassguitar in the world but are excellent Rock bassists. Both of them auditioned. They did say that literally every wellknown Bassplyer in the world went down to try out.
Personally I have a feeling that some guys turned the Stones down and not vicecersa. Flea e.g

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

If I remember well, they sessioned at least 25 bassists. And nowadays, manny bassists like to point out in interviews that they sessioned for the Stones while they even didn't, only to boost their CV's.

According to some bassists, many turned the Stones down due to the package offered. With the Stones you would have become a hired session player, earning a set sum of money, and you weren't allowed to do sessions or tours with other artists. For many of the better session men, like Flea, Pino Pallidino, Doug Wimbish and Joey Spampinato this deal sucks big time.

In my opinion, they hired the worst guy for this job. He is an excellent, skilled bassist, but he just doesn't have the R&R feeling. He just can't do it. Why they didn't hire Pino or Joey (the favorites of Keith) is beyond me.

Mathijs

Mathijs, is Bill Wyman a good bass player, btw?

I think many of Mathijs' earlier posts state a loud and clear YES to that question At least in terms of "the swing".

Bill was great and he is missed. Even Keith says so.

How can you ask someone "IS Bill a good Bass player?" LOL. Or was it sarcastic?

I know that they did audition a whole lot more than 25 Bassists. If you want to take Keith's word, from his mouth to some of the candidates. Maybe some of the Dutch bassists arehaving to pad their CV by making up stories

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

Mathijs Wrote:
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> Why they didn't hire Pino or Joey
> (the favorites of Keith) is beyond me.


In a 1994 interview Keith said that in the end they let Charlie pick the bass player. He's the one who has to swing with him. And Charlie picked Darryll Jones, which was a great choice I might add. It's untrue that Darryll doesn't have a rock 'n roll swing. He does. Just listen to You Got Me Rocking. And you know that The Stones isn't only rock 'n roll (Though they sing that it is ). It's also funk and soul and blues and tons of other stuff (Despite what Ferrante says ).

Wasn't that Mechelle N'Deogello (Completely wrong spelling there ) at a session too???

JumpingKentFlash

ChelseaDrugstore Wrote:
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> How can you ask someone "IS Bill a good Bass
> player?" LOL. Or was it sarcastic?

No, I wasn't being sarcastic. Ronnie and Keith are known for not being the best guitar players in the world. Still, I think they are great. I only asked if BW is considered, by other bass players (impotrtant !), as one of the best.

Harm, I was only asking about the phrasing. Like to ask someone "IS so and so a good bassist?" Seems to me that this is strictly a subjective Q & Q. The matter at hand is not a fact; it is an opinion. Never mind that most of us here comnsider Bill Wyman one of the great bassist ever (rightfully so I might add LOL). And also I don't concern myself about soem lost souls not realizing that Ron and Keith are two of the greatest guitarslingers ever. People who do not see this, especially guitarrists, I feel for.

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

JumpingKentFlash Wrote:
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> Wasn't that Mechelle N'Deogello (Completely wrong spelling there) at a session too???

Not during the VL sessions/auditions.
Me’Shell Ndegeocello plays on Saint Of Me, though.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-01-06 14:57 by erikjjf.

eriik which tune did she do again? Was it Saint of Me?

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

Right

Duh!! LOL I saw your post and I SWEAR it said Mshell plays on bridegs to Babylon. Right at the moment I am driving so the way I'm reading is kind of suspect. I hope this is also the cause of all my tyupos.

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

How can you answer a question like that? Great bassplayer? One of the best? I would say he was (is) solid and fit with this band. The same with Charlie, I think. Most drummers I have talked to about Charlie were just laughing when I mentioned his name. But he is a solid drummer, that's for sure and there is probably no one in the world who could really take his place ...without making them a different band.

erikjjf Wrote:
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> Not during the VL sessions/auditions.
> Me’Shell Ndegeocello plays on Saint Of Me, though.


I knew she was on B2B. I just thought she auditioned in 94 too.

Thanks.

JumpingKentFlash

From a technical point of view Wyman is a terrible player -he plays with only two fingers (mainly his index and little finger), and he has a terrible way of plucking the strings. But for the Stones, he is the best bassist you can imagine. Also if you listen to Bill when he plays with different people -Howlin Wolf in 1970, ARMS in 1984, he has this incredible way of making the music swing, while playing very little notes. He has this swing beat / jazz feeling in his playing. His bass lines are little melodies itself, much like Taylor's solo's are little pieces of music. Charlie Watts and Bill Wyman is what made the Stones, simple as that. Daryl Jones just doens't understand it, he just doesn't understand Stones music. Technically he is much more advanced than Wyman, but he just doesn't have the swing, the feeling, and also important, the sound. Daryl's sound is slick, while Wyman's sound was always fat.

And if you point out You Got ME Rocking: that's exactly what I mean with not understanding the Stones. All Darylm does is slapping out "on the one" of the beat. It is a prime example of why I think Daryl really doesn't fit.

Mathijs

So what you're really saying is that one should pik if they like talented playing (Wyman's talent) or advanced skill (Jones' skill)? It's very hard to pick. I like both. And I love the way the Stones swing nowadays. That being said there's many cool boots of Wyman playing great (Example: Rock 'n Roll Stew bootleg).

JumpingKentFlash

wahwahwoody Wrote:
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> How can you answer a question like that? Great
> bassplayer?

Maybe to get an answer like Mathijs

Man I agree with Matijs so much on the Wyman thing. I see it the same way. Bill has the most god-awful technique. Not even so much his left hand with which in tyhe early days he seemed to mainly play octaves and fifths. Just like Mathijs says when you are using those two fingers they are just laid in such a position on the fets that those are the notes they hit. You really can't go wrong with that position as a Bassist. It's what Wyman did with it that is great. His right hand is just as bad. He uses a pick a lot but it doesn't really come off as pick playing. But neither does it run like finger playing. At times he sounds real bug and fat on ballads with these juicy slides in there like in 70's on "Fool to Cry" or "Ventilator Blues". Then in 78 and 81 he stretd playing so mauch more runs. And these are never fixed lines; you can tell he is free styling; hardly ever plays the same thing twice within a verse. He doesn't have a very adventuorus ear, as far as notes go. He is still within that very safe parameter of rootnote, 4th and fifths. He just...was so damn good. He is one of the most baffling musicians ever.
The whole magic of the machineroom that Keith and Charlie and Bill and countless reviewers talk about? It is in plain evidence all over Ya-Ya-s' the live "Rambler" is perfection.The weird thing is that Wyman lags. He is BEHIND Charlie, and especially Keith. To me one of the reasons the Stones are what they are is that whole unexplainable phenomenon. I think Mathijs might agree with me, that Wyman IMO is the key ingredient in the Stone Soup. Without Wyman they are never going to get that swing again. DJ does not have it. DJ playing rock is just...wrong. He tries way too hard. One can always tell he is having to think about it.
On Bridges there are tracks where the Stones actually swing and behold! DJ is not on Bass. "Flip the Switch", Lowdown, OOC, TITN etc

"...no longer shall you trudge 'cross my peaceful mind."

Well, I think the main ingredients to why the Stones were the greatest band in the world are: 1) Watts and Wyman as a rythm section, 2) Jagger and Richards' songwriting and 3) Jagger as a showman/entertainer. Take out any of the three ingredients, and the Stones drop from being the greatest to "just another band". I do think all the rest -Taylor, Wood, Jones, the piano players- is all just icing on the cake. I enjoy Taylor as much as anyone else, but he is not a key ingredient to the success of the Stones.

John Mayall's reaction to the departure of Clapton from the Bluesbreakers was "it's not like the bassplayer leaves, that would destroy the band. The guitarist is replacable".

Ever since Wyman left, the Stones transformed from the greatest band in the world to "just another band". A great "another" band, but not the mythical band like the once were.

Mathijs

interesting, Mathijs - where do you place Keith as a musician in the list of "ingredients"?


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2006-01-06 17:26 by with sssoul.

ChelseaDrugstore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The weird thing
> is that Wyman lags. He is BEHIND Charlie, and
> especially Keith. To me one of the reasons the
> Stones are what they are is that whole
> unexplainable phenomenon.

I agree - and to make the mess even bigger, Keith is slightly ahead of Charlie.


BTW, the bassguitar lag is very well audible in Satisfaction.

well, Bill's pointed that out: that Charlie always follows Keith - "because there's nothing else you can do" - and he follows Charlie,
and that tiny lag is what makes the Stones' sound so inimitable.


"What do you want - what?!"
- Keith

Mathijs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >
> In my opinion, they hired the worst guy for this
> job. He is an excellent, skilled bassist, but he
> just doesn't have the R&R feeling. He just
> can't do it. Why they didn't hire Pino or Joey
> (the favorites of Keith) is beyond me.
>

It's 100% impossible to have a great live concert without a GREAT bass player... tell me how you can do that...

And yet look at all the concert reviews since Daryl Jones took over one of the most demanding jobs in all of music.

Quick question: Since you hate Jones, and find, astonishingly that he has "no rhythm", have you attended ANY good Stones concerts from VooDoo Lounge on ??

ALSO, if we can only trust one person's opinion of whether Daryl has "R&R", should we trust:

A) Mathjis OR Miles Davis ??



"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."

not the same w/ out Wymann no question.....

FWIW, among the 25+ bassplayers I've heard rumored to have been auditioned was Stu Cook of Creedence.

"It's just that demon life has got me in it's sway..."