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Rocky Dijon
This is the best article on the site. This stuff belongs on The Onion.

[anolen.com]

"In this post I’m going to highlight some unsavory history about the founding of The Rolling Stones. As many people already suspect, this band was almost certainly a creation of the Anglo-American ‘intelligence community’. I believe that The Rolling Stones were created in response to the failure of earlier ‘non-communist left’ undertakings such as the Congress for Cultural Freedom, which by 1962 had been ‘outed’. Our story begins in the Cotswold hills…"

I haven't read the whole thing, but get the general idea, and think it is preposterous. However, there is a bit of evidence to support the assertion that the 'Acid King' David Schneiderman, who supplied the drugs for the Redlands bust was indeed working for the FBI or CIA. He had been roped in to save himself from prison.

Schneiderman was a Canadian intelligence agent. Fraser did work for British Intelligence, but had ostensibly repudiated his background. There has been a lot of speculation about Kenneth Anger. The whole Stones bit is ridiculous of course, but they ran with an interesting crowd.

Keith said himself, "Gonna find my way to heaven 'cause I did my time in hell." He married Patti, and she later became a born-again christian. Must've had enough of the darkness, and chose the light, instead.

If you go in for conspiracy theories, there is a Stones presence in this article.

Operation Chaos

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Rocky Dijon
This is the best article on the site. This stuff belongs on The Onion.

[anolen.com]

"In this post I’m going to highlight some unsavory history about the founding of The Rolling Stones. As many people already suspect, this band was almost certainly a creation of the Anglo-American ‘intelligence community’. I believe that The Rolling Stones were created in response to the failure of earlier ‘non-communist left’ undertakings such as the Congress for Cultural Freedom, which by 1962 had been ‘outed’. Our story begins in the Cotswold hills…"

Unfortunately, the site owner has taken everything down.

Whatever " FAME" Anita has achieved, it is strictly by ASSOCIATION....with the Stones. I have always felt that the band would have been WAY better off had they never met her. Song influences!? Maybe...so what, there would have been other songs and other influences..and some not as lethal as Anita's influence. I will never understand the fascination with this SLEAZY, addicted, evil person. I say evil as in messing with multiple band members and knowingly causing some pretty catastophic events. And I'm certain she is responsible for things none of us will EVER know! Do you get the feeling I am NOT an Anita fan??

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mickschix
Whatever " FAME" Anita has achieved, it is strictly by ASSOCIATION....with the Stones. I have always felt that the band would have been WAY better off had they never met her. Song influences!? Maybe...so what, there would have been other songs and other influences..and some not as lethal as Anita's influence. I will never understand the fascination with this SLEAZY, addicted, evil person. I say evil as in messing with multiple band members and knowingly causing some pretty catastophic events. And I'm certain she is responsible for things none of us will EVER know! Do you get the feeling I am NOT an Anita fan??

She had a big influence on stones and im a big Anita fan and im addicted too.

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mickschix
Whatever " FAME" Anita has achieved, it is strictly by ASSOCIATION....with the Stones. I have always felt that the band would have been WAY better off had they never met her. Song influences!? Maybe...so what, there would have been other songs and other influences..and some not as lethal as Anita's influence. I will never understand the fascination with this SLEAZY, addicted, evil person. I say evil as in messing with multiple band members and knowingly causing some pretty catastophic events. And I'm certain she is responsible for things none of us will EVER know! Do you get the feeling I am NOT an Anita fan??

Anita did have her own modeling and acting career, but yes, mostly she is known for her association with the band. To say she is to blame for events that happened within the band implies that they were powerless to resist her influence. Everyone pays the price for their own actions, including the members of The Rolling Stones. Anita is not responsible for what any of them did, they chose their own course, just like the rest of us.

Anita was often a mess but she was not without artistic talent.
Several fine European directors saw her as an actress with true potential.
But she and Keith were very screwed up re drugs, as is well known.

Like I said, famous by ASSOCIATION. Her " modeling career" was slight. Her acting abilities nill, or next to nill. Potential? Well, you could say that about most people. And sure, the Stones had control over their destinies however, during that drugged-out period, it probably was easier to manipulate all of them....they were easy prey, and I am sure she knew it. She tagged along for way too long.IMO. I shall never think differently about her...she's a 1/2 step above a prostitute in my book. Not sorry for my opinion, and I wonder how the other Stones women viewed her...I'd LOVE to ask Jerry's opinion, or Bianca's.

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mickschix
Like I said, famous by ASSOCIATION. Her " modeling career" was slight. Her acting abilities nill, or next to nill. Potential? Well, you could say that about most people. And sure, the Stones had control over their destinies however, during that drugged-out period, it probably was easier to manipulate all of them....they were easy prey, and I am sure she knew it. She tagged along for way too long.IMO. I shall never think differently about her...she's a 1/2 step above a prostitute in my book. Not sorry for my opinion, and I wonder how the other Stones women viewed her...I'd LOVE to ask Jerry's opinion, or Bianca's.

Yeah and the stones made crappy albums in their drugged-out period. Maybe we shall blame it on Anita

You know I like you MicksChix but I hate to see women beat up on other women
especially if they don't know them.

The Stones were "big boys" and she didn't have a gun in their ribs.

The behavior of certain Stones regarding women and drugs could be quite
disgusting.

Frankly, I am amazed and grateful that both Keith and Anita are alive today.
I always thought little Marlon, still a baby was the class act of the family.

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stonesrule
You know I like you MicksChix but I hate to see women beat up on other women
especially if they don't know them.

The Stones were "big boys" and she didn't have a gun in their ribs.

The behavior of certain Stones regarding women and drugs could be quite
disgusting.

Frankly, I am amazed and grateful that both Keith and Anita are alive today.
I always thought little Marlon, still a baby was the class act of the family.

Ha! I hope it's not strictly a women on women issue here stonesrule. But I do believe it's a bit of a cheap shot to attack Anita at this point. It's too easy to take apart someone who obviously was sick with a drug problem from early on. I'm sure she would have probably taken a different path if she knew the suffering that lied ahead. But like you say, both seem happy and relatively healthy today, the kids turned out OK and all's well in Stonesville. Good enough for me.

I will admit my fascination with Anita and will add on her behalf that Keith sure seemed to love her, who are we to judge affairs of the heart? I'm sure he still loves her on some level and I will further admit that on some level...I do too.

I don't see this as a chick on chick attack, I see it as my opinion of her which is not the same one that you have, Stonesrule...and I happen to like you too! And Natualust, I don't view it as a cheap shot just because she had a drug problem because that has nothing to do with my dislike for her. All of the Stones had drug problems and I love them! I don't like her because I viewed her as trashy, not a class act at all. It could be argued that our Boys were not always classy when under the influence and I never condoned Brians treatment of her. I thought he was a horrible bully ! Still I never liked her. She was far from modest and I lumped her into the groupie category....which really is not far from the truth.
And I like you too, even though you said I took a " cheap shot" at Anita. I never saw her as a tragic figure, rather a mere hanger-on, and I too think Marlon turned out just fine, amazingly enough.

I understood where you're coming from mickschix (FWIW I am also female)

I know Anita is quiet on publicity, recently I saw a video of her speaking w/ interviewer around 50 and counting time, I clicked to watch, and first thing she is speaking about, almost with pride, is when she met the Stones (Brian, etc. probably) she starts regaling right away she had drugs, offered it to them, got high, like she was proud of that-

I got turned off/ shut it off. I'm not judging her, I'm on no pedestal and understand addiction, but let's face it there is an implied double standard with women drug addicts. Especially when they are mothers (rightly so, like it or not, the kids primarily fall on the mother.)

Different times. When we know better, we do better.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-08-01 02:34 by 35love.

Well Ladies...and how often do we get to say that around here...

If I had never known Anita I would likely share your opinions instantly!

35love, I have to say that I am somewhat horrified that Anita would be so quick
to talk about drugs and "the men". The British press is very good in going for gut but I should have imagined Anita and her rep would have wished for
a slightly more "classy" opening. Who knows how it all came about? And THUS
35Love I can understand your reactions.

Is the womanly scorn only for Anita? What about the various men involved?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-08-01 03:04 by stonesrule.

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mickschix
I don't see this as a chick on chick attack, I see it as my opinion of her which is not the same one that you have, Stonesrule...and I happen to like you too! And Natualust, I don't view it as a cheap shot just because she had a drug problem because that has nothing to do with my dislike for her. All of the Stones had drug problems and I love them! I don't like her because I viewed her as trashy, not a class act at all. It could be argued that our Boys were not always classy when under the influence and I never condoned Brians treatment of her. I thought he was a horrible bully ! Still I never liked her. She was far from modest and I lumped her into the groupie category....which really is not far from the truth.
And I like you too, even though you said I took a " cheap shot" at Anita. I never saw her as a tragic figure, rather a mere hanger-on, and I too think Marlon turned out just fine, amazingly enough.

I was my understanding that Anita added some level of culture and intelligence to the early Stones circle. She apparently is very smart, knows several languages, and had a very artistic and interesting group of friends and associates she brought to the table in the early days. If classiness is the reason you don't like her, fine, but I think you might be surprised at her level of class before the drugs started to effect her. I don't think any of the Stones you love so much were particularly classy, this is more than confirmed by James Pledge's book. Perhaps you are holding the women to a slightly higher standard than the men.

But of course you are entitled to your opinion, I just think if you actually met her in the late 60's or today, you might be quite surprised to find it a bit harsh.

Yeah, great points, I was aware of her intelligence (and gorgeous looks! Fashion, her own career, etc. she had displayed back then) I can certainly see and respect the allure-

and I did think 'what a crappy opener' when trying to view the video from around 50 and counting- and God bless her, living quiet life gardening and tending to her health/ out of Rock and Roll for decades,

maybe she thought that's what the fans wanted to hear most.

As we know, not many made it out of IV drug use from back then unscathed or, out at all :-(

She contributed to Keith's family with Marlon and that is a good thing. I think Kieth would agree to that.

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StonedAsia
She contributed to Keith's family with Marlon and that is a good thing. I think Kieth would agree to that.

Keith and Anita also have a daughter, Angela.

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latebloomer

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StonedAsia
She contributed to Keith's family with Marlon and that is a good thing. I think Kieth would agree to that.

Keith and Anita also have a daughter, Angela.

and grandchildren!

What amazes me is Anita's rehabilitation, going back about 20 years. It's true that apparently she has been financially supported by Keith straight through, and never had to support herself, but after their r'ship ended, in the 80s she had a terrible series of misfortunes - she was prosecuted for something in London, had a broken hip, has/had hepatitis C. The Scott Cantrell death left a long shadow over her reputation. Yet in the 90s, she turned her life around, cleaned herself up, lost a lot of weight, studied fashion design at St Martins which is very prestigious and competitive for entry. She has a huge number of celebrity friends who seem to be very loyal to her. Although I have only seen one photo of her with Angela (at her wedding), Anita is apparently close to Marlon. Patti has included her in the family circle. I can't recall a single interview where she hasn't sounded controlled and very lucid.

Naturalust, I AM aware that she had a " cultured background" but for me, that doesn't entitle her automatically to be classified as " classy"...I know MANY well-read and intellectual folks who are far from classy. This is the category I've put her in( NOT Classy)...and THERE she shall stay...and 35LOVE, thanks for chiming in. We can only base our impressions of her on what we read and have heard in MANY interviews since the '60's .... and STONESRULE, tell us more about your first-hand impressions of her. We don't KNOW her so, as I said, our impressions are second hand, media-based.

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mickschix
Naturalust, I AM aware that she had a " cultured background" but for me, that doesn't entitle her automatically to be classified as " classy"...I know MANY well-read and intellectual folks who are far from classy. This is the category I've put her in( NOT Classy)...and THERE she shall stay...and 35LOVE, thanks for chiming in. We can only base our impressions of her on what we read and have heard in MANY interviews since the '60's .... and STONESRULE, tell us more about your first-hand impressions of her. We don't KNOW her so, as I said, our impressions are second hand, media-based.

Well my dear when you look like Anita did in the late 60's classy is the last thing you gotta worry about. She seemed like a poster child for all that was exciting about those heady days. Raw beauty and intelligence combined with a bohemian lifestyle...it was a potent combination. Besides, it seemed like she was only one of millions of young ladies shedding their classy skins and lifestyles for a more natural and freer disposition. When you look at a festival like Woodstock for instance, I don't think classy is the word you would use to describe anyone's look or behavior. I think she was just a product of the times, possibly even a bit ahead of her time and classy just wasn't an attribute considered cool, desirable or particularly fashionable in the world of rock and roll.

Yes perhaps she wasn't classy, per se, but imo she was very interesting, very desirable and very rock and roll. Yes you can point to Bianca as someone who was classy and in the Stones circle from the early 70's but she never quite fit in did she? I'm trying to think of instances where class mixed with rock and roll and can't think of many really. Perhaps later day Robert Palmer or Steely Dan?

Brian Ferry?

Oh, lets not forget Marianne.....daughter of a Countess?

Plenty of people started out classy but went downhill with the rock'n'roll lifestyle. Alice Ormsby-Gore (Eric Clapton's gf) would be a prime example. Robert Fraser, Gram Parsons, and especially Brian Jones.

Well ... Brian's family wasn't upper-class by any stretch, were they?
And by all accounts he was already pretty wild before he got ahold of the rock & roll lyfestyle (or vice versa).
How old was he when he fathered his first child?

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Bliss
Plenty of people started out classy but went downhill with the rock'n'roll lifestyle. Alice Ormsby-Gore (Eric Clapton's gf) would be a prime example. Robert Fraser, Gram Parsons, and especially Brian Jones.

Yes and plenty of rock stars started off less than classy and eventually turned somewhat classy with the affluence they achieved through playing rock and roll too. I'm not sure Robert Fraser ever lost his class throughout his journey into the rock and roll world or that Gram Parsons or Brian Jones were ever considered truly classy. But no doubt drug addiction tends to have a negative effect on classiness and I'm guessing if Anita never went down that path we wouldn't be having this discussion.

The Brits still obsessed with "class" ?
I cant imagine people in LA having this debate.
Brian was classy...in the clothes sense....as Mick is also (and still).