I know the early to mid-60s Stones had a reputation for rudeness and dangerousness.

But to whom, and to what, was this attributable?

Mick and Brian were calculating enough to want to make the Stones big and get rich - and in that spirit, "played along" with things like washing their hair for Ed Sullivan, or "cleaning up" the LSTNT lyrics.

Keith was too shy in those days to visibly do much rude or dangerous. Bill was too quiet. Charlie too polite.

So which Stone(s) most contributed to the rude reputation?

And, other than the gas station incident and the Jukebox Jury appearance, what did they themselves ever do to have that reputation circa 1965?

I think it was pretty much others who were rude to them..especially older entertainers like Dean Martin..

but Brian, he seemed to go out of his way to torment that one dude who followed him around..forget his name..

Y'all gotta remember, the Stones were posed as bad boys as opposed to The Beatles back in the day. The Stones image was to look scruffy, unwashed, more basic than the Beatles. The Stones made good press and helped to sell many a newspaper and music mag back then.

I remember the Hollywood Palace show where Dean Martin brought on the Stones, Dino rolling his eyes and mocking the band. It was right up there with the late Steve Allen rolling his eyes and putting a hound dog, if I remember correctly, on stage with Elvis when he did "Hound Dog" on Allen's show.

As most of us know this was all a calculated PR by Andrew, they weren't rude at all and would not have lasted to long with the the lunatics that I grew up with in Chicago...They probably would have split after we took their smokes, booze and drugs away from them...As much as I like the Stones, they are not that rude or tough...all image making....Badass for Badass I would take John, George & Ringo over the whole gang of Stones.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-04-02 00:18 by 2120Wolf.

They just seemed like they were having fun except for the traveling in between gigs. Most people joined bands to stay out of trouble and a way to meet girls.

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dalsh327
They just seemed like they were having fun except for the traveling in between gigs. Most people joined bands to stay out of trouble and a way to meet girls.

Ohhh, I thought it was to play some music...meet some girls...and then get in trouble...that seems to be the general standard pattern, unless you end up dead...

Andrew Loog Oldham



ROCKMAN

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Rockman
Andrew Loog Oldham

As most of us know this was all a calculated PR by Andrew, they weren't rude at all and would not have lasted to long with the the lunatics that I grew up with in Chicago...They probably would have split after we took their smokes, booze and drugs away from them...As much as I like the Stones, they are not that rude or tough...all image making....Badass for Badass I would take John, George & Ringo over the whole gang of Stones.

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Rockman
Andrew Loog Oldham

Ha! "Suck it, Andrew!"

In some early pictures Bill Wyman adds a lot to their
dark image...underestimated!

they weren't rude at all and would not have lasted to long with the the lunatics that I grew up with in Chicago

But hey you can say that about a million so called tough guys ....
Sinatra without his pack or throw Rambo and Chuck Norris into a real war-zone and see what happens.... Now that'd be a sight ...HHaaaaaa



ROCKMAN

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Rockman
they weren't rude at all and would not have lasted to long with the the lunatics that I grew up with in Chicago

But hey you can say that about a million so called tough guys ....
Sinatra without his pack or throw Rambo and Chuck Norris into a real war-zone and see what happens.... Now that'd be a sight ...HHaaaaaa

True Rockman...I would not consider myself a tough guy, but in 79' a cop spit in my face...I bounced his face off the chrome bumper of a 74 Chevy, broke his nose and got charged with felony aggravated battery on a cop who was the nephew of Chicago's Superintendant of police...I highly doubt Sinatra, Rambo, Norris, Richards or Jones could ever make that claim...Charge reduced to simple battery, No time served, 1 Year Probation...one of many of my wild days !!!....Quite the Opposite of Police brutality !!! 5:6 150LBS at the time....

It was Bill!




"As we say in England, it can get a bit trainspottery"

I bounced his face off the chrome bumper of a 74 Chevy,


AAAHHHH the good ole days, when auto's had bumpers !!!!
Ya'd probably only crack the plastic shroud now days ..............



ROCKMAN

Maybe they weren't rude.......... but they look rude or pretend to look rude........... back in the early 60's.................. (didn't they pee in public on the streets Ahhhh man I never did this)

__________________________

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Rockman
I bounced his face off the chrome bumper of a 74 Chevy,


AAAHHHH the good ole days, when auto's had bumpers !!!!
Ya'd probably only crack the plastic shroud now days ..............

Yeah, I used o have a 77 Camaro Z/28 that had a front and rear bumper like a freakin' Hummer.

I remember reading an article (from the 70s I think) where it said that Wyman was a horrible little man who kept swearing all the time. Seems to fit some of the comments and articles posted above!

--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio

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Rockman
I bounced his face off the chrome bumper of a 74 Chevy,


AAAHHHH the good ole days, when auto's had bumpers !!!!
Ya'd probably only crack the plastic shroud now days ..............

Yes and with a decent lawyer you could get off easy, and laugh about it less than year later...Today I would be tagged a terrorist and sent off to Guantanamo to get waterboarded.

"Badass for Badass I would take John, George & Ringo over the whole gang of Stones"

What, no Paulie?

I tend to agree with the comment. Brian Epstein worked like hell to get the Beatles to clean up their act. It helped them become who they became.

Fred Flintstone was the earliest rude stone I can recall.

<<Brian, he seemed to go out of his way to torment that one dude who followed him around..forget his name..>>

That was during their Edith Grove days, and it was Richard Hattrell, a friend from Cheltenham. Brian acted that way as a front because he was self-conscious about both his and his friend's posh background, so he wanted to prove to the others that he was hard and fitted in.

Speaking of Edith Grove, Keith and James Phelge let themselves in to a neighbor's downstairs flat one day while the man was out, drank a bottle of the tenant's beer, and then replaced it with urine. That's a bit rude. Keith's behavior in those days seemed more mischievous than the others by far overall.

As far as publicly as celebrities, most of it was image and they seemed to be rather well behaved during interviews. Though Brian did once tell a TV host (of Shindig) to shut up, so that they could see special guest Howlin' Wolf perform.

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treaclefingers
Fred Flintstone was the earliest rude stone I can recall.

Yes, Freddy and the Rubble...No shit from nobody !!!

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dmay
"Badass for Badass I would take John, George & Ringo over the whole gang of Stones"

What, no Paulie?

I tend to agree with the comment. Brian Epstein worked like hell to get the Beatles to clean up their act. It helped them become who they became.

No doubt....and throw in Pete Best in their Punk Ass Hamburg days...The Savage Young Beatles !!!

"Rudeness' was an affectation invented by Andrew Loog Oldham to garner attention away from The Fab Four.

Andrew knew the band stood head and shoulders above The BeaTles live at that time. The band, esp. Brian, knew they were talented. But that's not enough. You've got to have SOMETHING that makes you stand out. Hence, the "Bad Boy" image projected w/the utmost sophistry onto the British (initially) & (secondarily) American & (ultimately) global public.

What nobody seems to understand is that at that time, the early 1960s, to use the wrong fork was considered exhibiting symptoms of Subverting The Dominant Paradigm.

The Subjects of the Damp And Soggy Isle possess a xenophobia wot's well-hidden until one (as in me) has visited there enough times and detected the unseen condition of hatred to anybody not "British" or whatever goes on in their 'eads.

It comes down to passive-aggressive silent scorn. But getting back to the image projected by the early Rolling Stones, it was schtick, rien plus.

Keith's reaction to the Irish fokking navy is related in this thread: [www.iorr.org]

There was also a story about Mick and Brian (I think?) smashing up a car stopped at a traffic light
just to terrorize the occupants - does anyone else remember that? Odd little incident

I hope James Phelge chimes in

Bill, probably had the toughest up bringing of the lot.Always looked much older back than he was. 1930s/40s Penge was piss poor enough without rationing on top, not a nice place to bring up a young family.

Probably contributed somewhat to his 'dark image'.