Mick Jagger's voice: Is he losing it? Has he lost it already?

Listen to this before and after. Which do you prefer? Or are the Stones basically a nostalgia act these days?

Obviously the guy is not 22 anymore. I don't think the he has lost his voice but it is different the sneer is gone. The Double Door version is laid back though just a warm up.

His hair looks worse in the 1965 version....eeek

mick's voice doesnt sound a long time anymore,like it should.everyone should know that.each tour it did get worse and worse.the whole band playz worse each tour.listen shine a light soundtrack for example.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2009-12-11 02:53 by cicilian nostra.

He sings better now than he did in 1975-76

Another ex-manager of the Rolling Stones has sued for royalties from The Verve's hit single "Bitter Sweet Symphony."

This time, the aggrieved party is Andrew Loog Oldham, who managed the Stones from 1963-67 and produced several Stones

albums. In a suit filed last week in England, Oldham contends he owns the orchestral recording of the Stones' "The Last Time" that The Verve sampled on "Bitter Sweet Symphony" (RealAudio excerpt) and therefore is owed up to 1 million pounds (about $1.7 million) in mechanical royalties.

In late 1997, The Verve settled a suit filed by Allen Klein, who managed the Stones from 1967-70. Klein still controls the songwriting copyright to "The Last Time" -- and all other songs the Stones wrote through 1970.

The Verve agreed to give the Stones' Mick Jagger and Keith Richards writing credit on "Bitter Sweet Symphony" and to turn over publishing royalties to Klein and his company, Abkco.

Oldham, reached at his home in Bogota, Colombia, on Monday, said he is seeking his share of the considerable revenue generated by "Bitter Sweet Symphony," which sold more than a million copies as a single and was used in advertising campaigns by Vauxhall, a European automobile company, and sneakers magnate Nike.

"I'm looking for royalties and damages for the illegal use of my recording that was copied or stolen or however you want to put it," Oldham said.

A London-based spokesperson for The Verve said the art-pop band had no comment, but he said the dispute seems to be between Oldham and Klein. "Money has been paid out that Loog Oldham hasn't received, and that's what the problem is," the spokesperson said.

Publicists for the Stones were unable to get a comment from the classic-rock band's current managers by press time.

The recording The Verve sampled is a version of the Stones' 1965 hit "The Last Time" that Oldham recorded for an album called The Rolling Stones Songbook, a collection of symphonic remakes released under the moniker the Andrew Oldham Orchestra.

It became a crucial part of the arrangement of "Bitter Sweet Symphony," the lead track from The Verve's 1997 album Urban Hymns.

Oldham said he tried negotiating with representatives from Virgin Records and lawyers for The Verve before he filed the suit.

"Efforts to deal out of court fell through in November," he said, without offering specifics.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2009-12-11 03:21 by mitchflorida.

Although the song's lyrics were written by Verve vocalist Richard Ashcroft, it has been credited to Keith Richards and Mick Jagger after charges by the original copyright owners that the song was plagiarized from the Andrew Oldham Orchestra recording of The Rolling Stones' 1965 song "The Last Time".

Originally, The Verve had negotiated a licence to use a sample from the Oldham recording, but it was successfully argued that the Verve had used 'too much' of the sample.[5] Despite having original lyrics, the music of "Bitter Sweet Symphony" is partially based on the Oldham track, which led to a lawsuit with ABKCO Records, Allen Klein's company that owns the rights to the Rolling Stones material of the 1960s. The matter was eventually settled, with copyright of the song reverting to ABKCO and songwriting credits to Jagger and Richards.

"We were told it was going to be a 50/50 split, and then they saw how well the record was doing," says band member Simon Jones. "They rung up and said 'we want 100 per cent or take it out of the shops', you don't have much choice."[6]

After losing the composer credits to the song, Richard Ashcroft commented, "This is the best song Jagger and Richards have written in 20 years."[7]
The song was later used, against the will of the band, by Nike in a shoe commercial.[when?] As a result, it was on the Illegal Art CD from the magazine Stay Free!. The song was also used in a Vauxhall Motors advertisement and several of Opel, prompting Ashcroft to declare onstage, "Don't buy Vauxhall cars, they're shit."[citation needed] However, the band were able to stop further use of the song by employing the European legal concept of moral rights.[citation needed]
On Ashcroft's return to touring, the song traditionally ended the set list. Ashcroft also reworked the single for 'VH2 Live' for the music channel VH1, stripping the song of its strings. Ashcroft is quoted as saying during the show: "Despite all the legal angles and the bullshit, strip down to the chords and the lyrics and the melody and you realise there is such a good song there."

He also dedicated the song to Mick Jagger and Keith Richards at a gig at the Sage Gateshead in Gateshead. After several audience members booed, Ashcroft exclaimed, "Don't boo, man. As long as I can play this song I'm happy to pay a few of those guys' bills."

In a Cash For Questions interview with Q magazine published in January 1999, Keith Richards was asked if he thought it was harsh taking all The Verve's royalties from "Bitter Sweet Symphony" to which he replied, "I'm out of whack here, this is serious lawyer shit. If The Verve can write a better song, they can keep the money."

GREAT VERSION OF LAST TIME from the Double Door gig! Swampy bluesy, and Jagger sounds fantastic!

I think he sounds fine. He seemed to be intentionally holding back, saving his voice. I'd rather hear him as per above any day, than with auto-tune enhancement.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-12-11 09:43 by swiss.

Yeah, Jagger sounds great at the Double Door.

Glad you enjoy the newer version. I think th earlier one is perfect and classic, the newer one is not worth listening to, IMHO.

Mick's definitely not the singer he was - he's lost most of the rawness and vitality, he just doesn't sound very fresh anymore, although to be honest i've heard much worse recent versions of The Last Time. He also struggles to hit the notes, and in many instances doesn't even try. I loved those Ed Sullivan show performances - i just think the version they did of Little Red Rooster was amazing, especially Brian's guitar playing, which is in a different league to the studio version. Also Jagger's voice was in really fine form. The Brian Jones era Stones were equally brilliant, if a little less sophisticated than the Mick Taylor era.

mick's singing voice has changed a few times over the yrs. it's due to the aging process and the yrs of cocaine use. as for andrew oldham it find it interesting that he waited until allen klein has passed away to sue . he had over a decade to do something. was he afraid of klein?

>> as for andrew oldham it find it interesting that he waited ... <<

ALO filed his lawsuit in 1999. mitchflorida just forgot to note that this is olds, not news

Mick's voice got lower when ageing .He can't reach hight notes ,it was obvious on the SAL movie.
The 2d version of the Last Time isn't that bad.



I am a Frenchie ,as Mick affectionately called them in the Old Grey Whistle Test in 1977 .

I had never heard about the lawsuit over The Last Time and Bittersweet Symphony. I don't know what role the Stones had in the lawsuit, or if this was just a money grab by Allen Klein, who seems to be a quite greedy.

I can see taking half of the royalties for the song, but ALL of them? That was nasty.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-12-11 13:18 by mitchflorida.

By the way, I think the first video of the Stones is historic, as I have never seen Charlie Watts ever smile while playing the drums before. I am thinking he was instructed not to smile later as part of his image?

merrily we troll along...

To my impression, Mick`s voice became lower, yes, but more free in intonations, in expression of emotions and sense of lyrics.

It's the same with every singer. If you compare a 1971-1973 live recording (omitting the discussion about the 1975/76 singing wich was at times horrible) against the newest live recordings you will find that Mick's voice has no more the range and dynamism of earlier times. But this is the ageing process and not his fault.

It's the same with Van Morrison, Rod Stewart (listen to the latest live recordings of 'People get ready' with Jeff Beck on YouTube, for example), Tom Jones or Joe Cocker. Without any trouble you can sing when you are young but as soon as you have to push your voice has aged. You can handlöe it in the studio but live recordings are a problem.

Its a fact of life: People get older.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2009-12-11 18:08 by ryanpow.

I really don;t like his singing anymore. It;s hard for me to listen to.
Like the way he sings Laugh, I Nearly Died. " I've been to Africa.a.a.a.a.a"
Lame


My 19 y/o daughter says he sounds like he's singing as he's walking past a graveyard. Nervous and scared sounding.

i think the problem with micks voice is he thinks too much about it. tries too hard to phrase. when he was younger he just sang and expressed his emotions naturally. now it´s all fake. he has no message anymore.

Mick Jagger had to work out his voice a little, if one gets older one has to do something to stay in shape. From 89 on Mick sang lightyears better than during many tours before, in 81/82 his singing was rather horrible. By the way, it is easy to find people who express their emotions through singing, but if they do not work out their voices they sound badly.

i agree that technically the modern mick is the better singer.

which shows how unimportant technique is.

mitch, what's the latest rating of "Best Ages to Be"? Where does age 66 rank?

might be interesting to do some kind of collation of "Best Drummers" and "Best Ages," don't you think? I wonder what the #1 age of the #1 drummer would be... 1?

Being a drummer is a very physical task, of course. Here is Carl Palmer who is 60 years old and I think is amazing. Plus I like how he looks . . he looks his age. . .not dying his hair black or whatever the Stones do. His present work stands up on its own, I think








Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-12-11 19:46 by mitchflorida.

For people who are interested in the origins of The Last Time, the controversy about Bittersweet Sympnhony, check out: [www.ethanhein.com].

The Stones adapted this song to make their hit.








Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-12-11 23:33 by mitchflorida.

Frankly, I wouldn;t go to see Mick just sing. To me, he isn't a vocalist per se.I view him as a performer and I would rather him be a showman like he was from 64-78 vs. hearing him "sing".

Is he so bad in singing, is Charlie so bad a drummer or are they so terrible a band as some stated in an earlier thread - their worst decade!!

















I think it is a very good band. Charlie is a fine drummer (would we like him with 100 drums hammering around, would we like Ronnie playing a 100 hit pr. minute guitar solo all time (sure he can if necessary)).
Lots of singers sing worse than Mick in his age (just listen to Macca).