Hi Group,

This must have been discussed many times in the past, but I heard an interview with Keith that Kenny Jones played drums on "It's Only Rock 'N' Roll" initially but then Charlie took over.

But listening to the track, the drumming does not seem to have that classic tension that Charlie is famous for, so I'm thinking that the drumming IS Kenny Jones' and that the group just went with what they had...

Am I incorrect?



Thanks,
Steve

I seem to remember hearing that the original track to IORR was recorded in Ronnie's basement with Keith and Ronnie on guitar/bass and Kenny Jones on drums, and (maybe) Bowie on some type of vocal. Ronnie eventually overdubbed some guitars and, who knows, maybe some vocals. When Keith got his hands on the tapes, he recorded over all of Ronnie's guitars except the 12 string acoustic. The Stones tried to record the track with Charlie and Bill, but it didn't sound quite as good, so they kept the original drum track (and, maybe bass?),

So, yeah, it's Kenny Jones on the final version. And, the song itself was probably written, in large part, by Ronnie.

I didn't do that, that was done - I was in bed at the time of that... And that was done - Kenny played that, Kenny Jones, they pulled HIM out' cause he lived near to Richmond. It was done in a very beautiful house in Richmond that Ronnie used to own. Pete Townshend owns it now, there's a bit of name-dropping isn't it, you'll like that.
Charlie Watts 2003

[www.timeisonourside.com]



ROCKMAN

Yes, Kenney Jones. Woody got him up at like 3 in the morning to get down to the studio because "he had Jagger there". In Max Weinberg's book, "the Big Beat" in which he has converstions with 14 famous drummers, he speaks to both Jones and Watts. They both told the story. Joke was, Watts said to Kenney when Jones apologized for moving into his territory,"It's alright, it sounds like me anyway." Actually, if you listen, it has all the Kenney Jones sound, deeper snare, and, listen particularly to the cymbal work which is classic Kenney Jones.

Wikepedia (I know they're not god) states that Willie Weeks plays bass on the cut. So who is playing on the music video for IORR? (The last appearance of MT with the Stones?) They're not playing the track from the single, so I thought maybe Charlie and Bill are on that one.

> So who is playing on the music video for IORR? (The last appearance of MT with the Stones?)

No:

Excerpts from the interview with Willie Weeks.

Q: What was it like touring with George Harrison?
Willie: It was top shelf—great band, great airplane, great food every night after the show, great hotels.
But if I could do that all over again I would be way more serious about the music.
I don’t think we pulled it off as well as we could have—as well as we should have. A lack of maturity played a part in that.
George was great to us. While dealing with voice problems and the media and all, he still kept an upbeat attitude.
I don’t know how much he enjoyed being the leader, but he was a pro throughout the tour. I’ll always cherish that.

Q: How did you end up recording on the Rolling Stones’ “It’s Only Rock ’n’ Roll (But I Like It)”?

Willie: It came about through Keith Richards. He was hanging out with Ronnie [Wood] when we were recording Ronnie’s record,
and Keith said, “We’ve got this track, man, and we’d like for you to put some bass on it.” And I said, “Yeah, of course.”
Andy Newmark and I drove out to Mick Jagger’s place, which ended up being a castle.
After we got there, we sat around waiting for an hour, and I finally said,
“Hey man, are we going to do this?” Within five minutes we were doing it.
They had a mobile studio set up in the back, and I listened to the tune and picked up my bass and started playing.
It was funny—Mick was standing in front of me and it was like he was directing me, but he was dancing! [Laughs.]
It was amazing, man. I’m standing there playing and listening to the music and looking at him and just feeling ... pretty magical.

Was that video for Till the Next Goodbye ever shown? I don't remember seeing it in the states. It's also the first time I remember seeing Mick Jagger in a video, or on stage, with a guitar. Wonder why nobody asked him why he sometimes seemed so 'fruity' from '69 to '78, and then he dropped the persona? Some calculated move I guess. He doesn't have a hint of that in his image now. Not much to be said for the video. No one even bothers to wear an electric guitar when there's an obvious lead part running through it.

"The Big Beat" is a great book. Haven't thought about it for years. Need to find my copy. Hope it wasn't lost in the flood.

So Weeks wasn't at Ronnie's for the original recording according to what he says.

How strange.

Keith had nothing to do with the song.

"Till the Next Goodbye" aired on DON KIRSHNER'S ROCK CONCERT the same week as "Ain't Too Proud To Beg."

Jagger and Woody may have done the original demo, but I'm sure Willie Weeks' recollection is correct. Keith was living at The Wick through much of this time. I know the accepted story is Keith overdubbed his parts in the studio months later and wiped all but Woody's 12-string. The truth may not have been as simple. We've only heard two versions of the song. The promo film backing track (which I also suspect has Bill and Charlie playing) and the released version with Willie and Kenny. The Stones often portray songs as coming together spontaneously (Keith's famous "It just happened, man" expression) but the lengthy sessions for Woody's first solo LP and Keith's protracted residency during those sessions makes it likely that Willie's account is accurate.

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Carnaby
Yes, Kenney Jones. Woody got him up at like 3 in the morning to get down to the studio because "he had Jagger there". In Max Weinberg's book, "the Big Beat" in which he has converstions with 14 famous drummers, he speaks to both Jones and Watts. They both told the story. Joke was, Watts said to Kenney when Jones apologized for moving into his territory,"It's alright, it sounds like me anyway." Actually, if you listen, it has all the Kenney Jones sound, deeper snare, and, listen particularly to the cymbal work which is classic Kenney Jones.

I very much like that book!

I think Kenny is a very good - if also a bit oldfashioned - drummer. One of my faves.
To be honest, Charlie couldn't have done this drum-part from IORR in that way. Drum and bass is great!

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Rocky Dijon
"Till the Next Goodbye" aired on DON KIRSHNER'S ROCK CONCERT the same week as "Ain't Too Proud To Beg."

When they showed "Till the Next Goodbye" "It's Only Rock n Roll" and "Ain't Too Proud to Beg" on Rock Concert, they also played three songs from Ladies and Gentlement: "All Down The Line" "Bye Bye Johnnie" and (I think) "Happy"

Seeing the '74 Stones right next to the '72 Stones didn't make the '74 version look so good....

>"The Big Beat" is a great book. Haven't thought about it for years. Need to find my copy. Hope it wasn't lost in the flood.

Speaking of Max Weinberg's "The Big Beat"-book: Ever discussed Bernard Purdie's claims on this board, that he was used for recording drum tracks (substituting for Charlie Watts) at Stones-sessions in the 60's?

N

The promo video has the same drums as the album version. Kenny Jones, that is. The only things that seem different are the lead guitar and vocals (and the mix).

I love the live vocals in the video

Amazin drumming by Kenney Jones-gives the number a unique feel-the Wood/Jones combination always had its own groove. As great a drummer as Charlie is he wouldnt have played it this way. IORR sounded real good live in 76 but the feel of the studio cut has a shuffle that never appeared again.

IORR is the 'hybrid' song between The Stones and The Faces.
The song could might as well have ended up on Woody's solo album and I Can Feel The Fire on the Stones album. Hard to tell actually, if IORR is a Stones number at all, but in name.

I'd love to hear Bowie vocals

<<I'd love to hear Bowie vocals>>

If you can stand this extremely low-fi live recording (from November 14, 1974 and dubbed to random 8-mm footage), you'll hear him blending the IORR chorus into the chorus for Diamond Dogs--which is a good indicator of what the main influence was, musically, for IORR. Was it perhaps a Jagger-Bowie song?







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-07-20 02:23 by stonehearted.

Quote
NeddieFlanders
>"The Big Beat" is a great book. Haven't thought about it for years. Need to find my copy. Hope it wasn't lost in the flood.

Speaking of Max Weinberg's "The Big Beat"-book: Ever discussed Bernard Purdie's claims on this board, that he was used for recording drum tracks (substituting for Charlie Watts) at Stones-sessions in the 60's?

N

Never heard of purdie covering for Charlie

Interesting that Wood appears on an album before he joined the Stones (IORR) and Taylor appears on one after he (Taylor) left the Stones (Tattoo You).

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Gooo

Quote
NeddieFlanders
>"The Big Beat" is a great book. Haven't thought about it for years. Need to find my copy. Hope it wasn't lost in the flood.

Speaking of Max Weinberg's "The Big Beat"-book: Ever discussed Bernard Purdie's claims on this board, that he was used for recording drum tracks (substituting for Charlie Watts) at Stones-sessions in the 60's?

N

Never heard of purdie covering for Charlie

Purdie claims it in a lenghthy interview in Max Weinberg's 'The Big Beat'-book.
But I never heard about that from anywhere else either.

N

Yeah I never cared for that fruity Jagger either.

You mean this very site is named after a song with Kenny Jones on drums?? The horror?

Rename it JJF.ORG this instant!

It's a bit comical watching the video knowing mick Taylor, bill and Charlie didn't even play on the track. I knew the guitars were keith but Kenny jones and Ronnie on bass is new to this old guy.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-07-21 03:58 by Markdog.

Purdie claims he subbed for Ringo too...In his dreams.

Purdie was good

Why would he lie

Quote
stonehearted
<<I'd love to hear Bowie vocals>>

If you can stand this extremely low-fi live recording (from November 14, 1974 and dubbed to random 8-mm footage), you'll hear him blending the IORR chorus into the chorus for Diamond Dogs--which is a good indicator of what the main influence was, musically, for IORR. Was it perhaps a Jagger-Bowie song?

IORR, the single was released 26 July 1974. Jagger's 31st birthday. Means Bowie had a good 3.5 months to hear the track on heavy radio rotation prior to his live rendition in the linked youtube video.

Yeah, why should he lie? Well, there's always a reason - but it could be true.
Sessions like that were pretty common in the 60's and it was no big thing.
Studio musicians were playing on many 60's stuff/ hits without mentioning it then.