[www.timhinkley.com]

Never heard of him, but thats an interesting tale. Thanks for sharing.

He's a bit off in his dates though in the very first line. It would have been fall 1977, not fall 1978.

Now Chris K. remembers... (he's less bitter!)

[www.soundonsound.com]

interesting...can only imagine how many other stories like this have never been brought to public light...

"within 24 hours of 'Miss You', 'Start Me Up' was recorded."
What's not to love with the Stones!



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2009-02-07 19:41 by dcba.

Thanks, dbca. Very interesting. But why would the group (or whoever) want to wipe McLagan's parts in the first place? Any theories?

Quote
parislocksmith
Thanks, dbca. Very interesting. But why would the group (or whoever) want to wipe McLagan's parts in the first place? Any theories?

i have a $en$e of why they may have done that

Or is it the Axl Rose syndroma : "You piss me off? I'll kick you out of the studio and I'll get a guy to play over your parts!"

It seems a big shame a lot of these good memories are tinged with bitterness over monies owed. You would not expect the band to be personally involved in paying cash on the day to session men, it should of course be done properly through the management. Clearly, that set up did not exist in those days.

Cool story...thanx for posting...

Quote
dcba
Or is it the Axl Rose syndroma : "You piss me off? I'll kick you out of the studio and I'll get a guy to play over your parts!"

then why invite him back for not one, but two subsequent tours?

Well some people break up with their old lady and THEN marry them.

More seriously Ian M. was flown in at the very last minute for the 78 tour. He basically took a flight from London to Florida, "rehearsed", played the 1st show then went to bed. He hadn't slept in 48 hrs...
Hardly a way to treat a 6th member, but a normal way to treat a stooge...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-02-07 20:14 by dcba.

Quote
dcba
Well some people break up with their old lady and THEN marry them.

More seriously Ian M. was flown in at the very last minute for the 78 tour. He basically took a flight from London to Florida, "rehearsed", played the 1st show then went to bed. He hadn't slept in 48 hrs...
Hardly a way to treat a 6th member, but a normal way to treat a stooge...

of course....but there's no reason to believe that anger fueled the erasure of his work. when in doubt, alway$ a$$ume it$ about the money

Pretty sure Tim Hinkley means EMOTIONAL RESCUE, not SOME GIRLS. Mick had a beard during the ER sessions which did indeed start in the Fall of '78. Mac is credited on SOME GIRLS, but not on EMOTIONAL RESCUE and according to Mac's book that was the album he started work on and was then replaced. I would suspect that Nicky Hopkins (who is credited) replaced Tim's work. As for the shabby treatment he received, its interesting he doesn't think he should have had to pay for all of the coke he snorted.

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Rocky Dijon
Pretty sure Tim Hinkley means EMOTIONAL RESCUE, not SOME GIRLS. Mick had a beard during the ER sessions which did indeed start in the Fall of '78. Mac is credited on SOME GIRLS, but not on EMOTIONAL RESCUE and according to Mac's book that was the album he started work on and was then replaced. I would suspect that Nicky Hopkins (who is credited) replaced Tim's work. As for the shabby treatment he received, its interesting he doesn't think he should have had to pay for all of the coke he snorted.

yeah - the timing and the beard thing certainly raises these questions. and, without going back to mac's book for reference myself, what you say sounds familiar. coke and 30 year's worth of hindsight will do that to one's memory, i guess....

on a side note, Kimseys report sheds a light on the probability of finished outtakes from 1971 onwards which could theoretically pop up on Universal "Deluxe" editions - he mentions that the tracks he chose for Tattoo You were ALL UNFINISHED, in particular they lacked finished vocals, and that was the reason why Jagger had to write lyrics and record them during the Tattoo You production. this does not coincide with the "top of the iceberg" theory some posters here on this board came up with, which basically means that the finished tracks we know (Drift Away, We Had It All, Save Me, Claudine and the likes) could only be a fraction of the finished tracks that are buried in the Stones vaults.

as Ive entioned before in other threads, given the very nature of the Stones recording methods once ever-increasing multitracks made recording more and more comfortable, I highly doubt that the vaults from 1971 onwards contain many outtakes that are finished and releasable "as is".

its well possible that at this very moment, Jagger is working in a studio somewhere on this whole wide world to record vocals for, lets say, Fiji Jim, Yellow Cab or Living Is A Harder Love, but I have my doubts.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2009-02-07 21:42 by alimente.

Great article with Kimsey. It's amazing the Stones have ever done anything. And they are obviously oafs when it comes to getting things done. Their penny pinching is hilarious and sheds light on why they started charging so much money for their tours - they are SO greedy that they are cheap with making records and bust the bank with their stages.

Actually, we've all acted rudely in our pasts, made bad assumptions and not known how to stand up for ourselves etc.

I'd dislike being "judged" on a permanent basis for some of my behaviour thirty years ago. If anyone was at fault here it was Kimsey for not seeing that the person he hired was taken care of.

Furthur if Mick was such a monster how do you account for the fact that the Stones have crew personnel who have been with them for many years and actually like Mick?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2009-02-07 23:33 by stonesrule.

Quote
T&A

Quote
parislocksmith
Thanks, dbca. Very interesting. But why would the group (or whoever) want to wipe McLagan's parts in the first place? Any theories?

i have a $en$e of why they may have done that

I agree with T & A that $$$ probably was the reason.

Which brings me to this question.

Who makes these calls for the Stones in this type of situation?

I doubt that it could have been Keith during these sessions. I don't think he would have been lucid long enough to think it thru.

Is it Mick or is it management along with Mick?

He did 200 quids worth of coke. That's a lot!

NickB

You can't always get what you want.....

www.myspace.com/thesonkings

"Great article with Kimsey. It's amazing the Stones have ever done anything. And they are obviously oafs when it comes to getting things done"

Funny I got the opposite impression out of the article. I got the feeling they were, in this studio, hit by some stroke of genius (for the very last time?), minus the "dump it, it's shit" judgement by Keith on "Start Me Up" of course.

I think they were inspired AND dedicated. Remember, one day during the sessions C.W. did not leave his drum stool (except for a pee) for 18 hours in a row.

And now more Kimsey :
[mixonline.com]

Quote
dcba
"Great article with Kimsey. It's amazing the Stones have ever done anything. And they are obviously oafs when it comes to getting things done"

Funny I got the opposite impression out of the article. I got the feeling they were, in this studio, hit by some stroke of genius (for the very last time?), minus the "dump it, it's shit" judgement by Keith on "Start Me Up" of course.

I think they were inspired AND dedicated. Remember, one day during the sessions C.W. did not leave his drum stool (except for a pee) for 18 hours in a row.

And now more Kimsey :
[mixonline.com]

real drummers just stay and pee - that's more rocknroll....

But was money really the only reason? Apparantly, McLagan's parts weren't completely wiped and he didn't get paid or any credits anyway either.

Perhaps we should just ask the man: [www.ianmclagan.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-02-08 00:55 by parislocksmith.

>> Pretty sure Tim Hinkley means EMOTIONAL RESCUE, not SOME GIRLS. <<

thank you, Rocky Dijon - that's the only way it would make any sense



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-02-08 12:37 by with sssoul.

I just yesterday saw several photos of Jagger with the beard in action; in the studio playing guitar, and singing at the mike with full beard - and he actually looks good!
Jagger manages to pull off every look he wants. Except Ned Kelley.

Quote
Palace Revolution 2000
I just yesterday saw several photos of Jagger with the beard in action; in the studio playing guitar, and singing at the mike with full beard - and he actually looks good!
Jagger manages to pull off every look he wants. Except Ned Kelley.

Please tell us the source of this picture where MJ with a beard playing guitar in a studio. I have never seen such a picture.

Django - there is a boot called "Tattoo Too". I have had it for ages. Yesterday I bit the bullet and decided to take on the mammoth task of organizing my boots. So I found myself revisiting many old discs. And it was he first time actually folded out the artwork of that disc. It has a big foldout; almost a poster with many many photos. That is where that shot of Jagger comes from that was recently in some thread; the one where he looks like Jesse Ed Davis. There are many great shots from the sessions that have to be strictly ER and TY.

.....................Jagger - Paris October 1979



ROCKMAN

Quote
Palace Revolution 2000
Django - there is a boot called "Tattoo Too". I have had it for ages. Yesterday I bit the bullet and decided to take on the mammoth task of organizing my boots. So I found myself revisiting many old discs. And it was he first time actually folded out the artwork of that disc. It has a big foldout; almost a poster with many many photos. That is where that shot of Jagger comes from that was recently in some thread; the one where he looks like Jesse Ed Davis. There are many great shots from the sessions that have to be strictly ER and TY.

You are right. I did not remember this boot and the pictures. Great boot, great 16 page colored booklet and ...... Mick with a beard playing guitar in the studio.

I'm sure it's Mac on Some Girls. I assume Hinkley talks about the ER-sessions
in late 1979. At most he replaced some parts that Mac did at the RCA Sessions
after the 1978 US tour.

Some years ago there was a similar insider story by some Martin Gordon on
the net. He claimed he replaced Bill Wyman on two nights during the ER-sessions,
working on a track which he called Time Flies. Unfortunately this story seems
to be off (as google just told me).

N